Elliott C. Back: Technology FTW!

Spread firefox? How about Spread IE 6.0 Service Pack 2!

Posted in Browsers, Microsoft, Spread IE by Elliott Back on October 4th, 2004.

Sorry SpreadFirefox. Firefox 1.0 just isn’t a substantially better product than Microsoft IE6.0, which shipped three years ago.

From the Firefox main page, here is its feature list:

Popup Blocking

Microsoft released a service pack to update IE with popup blocking.

Tabbed Browsing

Present in a feature called “taskbar grouping” in Windows XP. More flexible than just for IE, though. You can use the tabbed motif for all your applications with taskbar grouping, not just the browser.

Privacy and Security

Service Pack 2 added numerous improvements to the Internet Explorer security model. And, for all the complaining about Internet Explorer’s security bugs, Firefox is not exempt.

Microsoft has had 44 security advisories in 20 months, for an average of 2.2 advisories per month, according to Secunia. Firefox has had 14 advisories in 6 months, for an average of 2.3 advisories per month. These figures are nearly identical–IE is no less secure.

Finally, compare the libPNG exploit with the GDI+ problem. They’re two sides of the same coin: the core windows/linux image handling libraries, used everywhere in both operating systems and products, including the web browsers, were vulnerable to exploit. I find this parallelism interesting-it implies that the similarities between both vendor’s security are greater than their differences. In the future, we’re going to see more Firefox security flaws paired with IE’s.

Smarter Search

See this knowledgebase article about configuring the default search behavior. IE has had automatic searching built into it for ages…

Live Bookmarks

RSS 2.0 wasn’t in extensive use when IE6 came out: this is a feature not present. However, this is a subset of the functionality of a larger class of programs called “RSS readers.” I don’t know if it is appropriate for a browser to manage RSS subscription.

Hassle-Free Downloading

The Firefox website is actually spreading deceptive marketing spin. Read, “Fewer prompts mean files download quicker.” Fewer prompts do NOT mean faster downloads. And how more “hassle-free” can you get than direct shell integration?

Fits Like a Glove

“Firefox has all the functions you’re used to - Bookmarks, History, Full Screen, Text Zooming,” the functions you first saw in Internet Explorer 6, three years ago.

S, M, L or XL-You Choose

Microsoft’s brower can add new toolbars, buttons, and extensions. Here’s a basic how-to for some of the easier things. SP2 also adds an easier way to manage add ons, although the ability to extend IE existed before Service Pack 2.

Setup’s a Snap

With Internet Explorer, there’s no setup required. You just have it, with your Windows installation!

A Developer’s Best Friend

IE6.0 has its own error checking, javascript console, and additional developer tools.

But this is just a feature comparison. I was personally curious about how they perform, head to head, so I wrote a testcase in C# to test their startup time. On my P4-M 1700, Firefox takes an average of 2.44 seconds to start. Internet Explorer 6.0 starts in just 1.17 seconds! Internet Explorer starts at least twice as fast as Firefox.

Loading up the latest Google News (10/4/2004) takes 0.5448 seconds in Firefox, but only 0.4887 seconds in the latest version of Internet Explorer. The rending time in IE 6.0 is 10.3% faster than in Firefox. Google News is 94kb of HTML with inline CSS, and 51kb of pictures, a good example of a high profile, high payload site.

Firefox took 19656kb of RAM on loading Google News, while Internet Explorer filled 17428kb, a memory footprint 2.23 megabytes smaller than Firefox. This is 11.3% better, a factor that becomes more important the older the computer you have.

In short, Internet Explorer 6.0 is a fast, modern, low-profile, standards-compliant, and feature rich browser, that is comparable on all terms to Firefox. It’s free with Microsoft Windows. So, unless you have an agenda against Microsoft, there are still no compelling reasons to switch to Firefox. Keep your IE–it’s good enough. (This post has been transferred from my old site to the new blog)

Viewing 36 Comments

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    First of all, Taskbar Grouping is NOT even REMOTELY the same as tabbed browsing. With tabbed browsing you can open several windows, say one for each task you are working on, and open several tabs with information on each task - it is extremely efficiant and effective. Taskbar grouping just doesnt cut it.

    It's not fair for you to read off the feature list and say "IE had this 6 years ago". Firefox has been under development for not much more than a year now and isnt even at a final release yet. And of course they are going to list "obvious" features on the site - that's what most users want to see!

    Regarding RSS - RSS is now probabaly the top use for XML on the web today. The Firefox developers saw this and added addional support basic but usefull support for it, while microsoft has just sat on their asses not adding any new features.

    The last thing I will comment on is installation where you totally missed the point. Firefox is as easy to install as possible for a program that Microsoft didnt bundle with the operating system.
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    I'm curious to know if you actually USED Firefox day to day rather than trying it just to critisize it?

    Popup Blocking: I have used IE6 SP2, and I have browsed various websites with it. The popup blocker works in some instances, but actually failed to stop quite a few. With Firefox, I haven't had one SINGLE popup. EVER.

    Tabbed Browsing: It's very nice that Windows XP has taskbar grouping, but taskbar grouping is nothing like tabbed browsing. Taskbar grouping keeps the taskbar somewhat clean when running multiple applications. Tabbed browsing lets you have various websites open in one window all accessible within ONE click. No clicking on arrows and choosing from TRUNCATED menus. Absolutely no comparison.

    Privacy and Security: I... I'm not even going to go into this one. IE6 SP2, while more secure, still falls victim to the so called "enhancements" and browser hijackings.

    Live Bookmarks: You're making excuses. The fact is, Firefox has it, IE doesn't. Period.

    Hassle-Free Downloading: Did you actually try playing with the download manager? Obviously not. You can make things substantially faster with some simple configuration with the options window. Choose what to do with different filetypes, or have files automatically save into a folder, no questions asked. IE's download management is, and always has been clunky.

    Fits Like a Glove: I don't think they were really trying to emphasize new features here... Just the things that people want.

    Setup's a Snap: IE does come with Windows. It comes with Windows, and you can't get rid of it no matter what you do. Using Windows Update to do what should take seconds is pointless, much like MSI. Why go through that whole process when you can just run one single file in a couple of seconds?

    A Developer's Best Friend: Does IE have a DOM browser? Extensions that allow you to disable images, CSS, and other things? The ability to quickly switch stylesheets? No, no, no, no, no... Oh, I lost count there.

    On my computer, Firefox is faster, both in loading, and browsing, and I didn't need to write an application to know that. Even if you have to wait a single additional second, the features are worth it.

    Firefox is a modern browser. You're talking about 2 megabytes from a beta web browser to something that's been around for 7 or 8 years now. If 2 megabytes is more than your computer can chew on, maybe try LYNX?

    How can you even try to call IE standards compliant? Have you read any design blogs? Have you done any CSS design at all? IE is standards compliant to standards that are years old. I recently had a run-in with "min-width" and "max-width". That's just an example that affected my design recently.

    IE is feature rich? IE has had the same basic features forever, and there's no hope of anything new ever entering the picture.

    I don't speak for the SpreadFirefox movement, but I sure haven't seen any anti-Microsoft propeganda. They speak facts. If you don't like it, don't read it, and don't switch.

    There are many compelling reasons to switch to Firefox, and unless you have your head up your ass, you'll see them quite clearly.
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    I think your opening claim is disingenious at best. Your list of features contains numerous references to service pack 2, which was released a month and a half ago, a far cry from your claim of three years. The IE released then clearly didn't have those features.

    Your information regarding customization is laughable - an article regarding changing the homepage hardly compares to the numerous extensions Firefox offers. Moreover, the point is that it OFFERS them - it allows the users the choice to customize their browser as they see fit, and aren't saddled with a myriad of features they have no interest in using.

    The link regarding security is similarly misleading - reading the article indicates that IE was equally vulnerable to a similar exploit. Moreover, the number of exploits IE is vulnerable to is exponentially more than Mozilla or Firefox, and the time taken to fix these exploits doesn't compare.

    I think there are SEVERAL compelling reasons to switch, but more importantly, I'd really like to see people who sling accusations of deceptive marketing be a little bit more honest in their own critiques.
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    You're obviously a close-minded individual who knows nothing of web standards. Of course it starts faster, it's already loaded most of the libraries used!

    That's in no way a comparison. How many people will sit there loading a browser and say "Well that's it! IE is better because it loads faster!"? I know, I know - it's the best sort of benchmark, it's for the people who see loading a browser continuously beneficial over actually using it.
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    I think the fact that Firefox automatically blocks pop-ups without the Google toolbar, the fact that it automatically keeps malware from being installed on my computer and the fact that I can look at JPEGs without being backdoored is enough to make me switch. But I switched at v0.7. I've never been happier.

    I'm glad I dumped IE on my PC and on the 25+ in my lab.
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    What about all the spieware that only runs in IE? What about all the fucking toolbars that only work in IE! lol you forgot a lot.
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    Author's note: All of the original, top level comments on the old blog that had subjectively enough non-anonymous information in them have been moved over.
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    IE Is Insecure.
    IE Is Proprietary.
    IE Is Feature Frozen.
    IE Will not be released independent of the OS.
    IE Support Non Standard HTML/CSS.
    IE Kills the Web.
    IE Is bad. Very bad.
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    ell oh ell. Look at all the angry Firefox users. I use Firefox, but if you are happy with IE, then congrats. I used IE for five or six years, tried Mozilla once, and was thoroughly unhappy.

    Gave Firefox a try finally, and after a bit, got hooked. And whenever someone complains about IE, I tell them to try out Firefox. My roommate is thoroughly impressed. But again, if someone is happy with IE, c'est la vie.

    It's similar to all of my Mac friends who constantly try to convert me. Get off my back.
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    Listen $&$ microsoft emplyer keep your stupid IE but stop saying lies about firefox OK?
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    Firefox prevents tracking cookies,spyware,toolbars and loads way faster than Internet crap explorer and doesnt crash when its used like IE does to me all the time! Hands down if you use IE and are happy updating every day because its such a POS,then go ahead and use it. Firefox and Thunderbird rock!
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    "Privacy and SecurityService Pack 2" & "Microsoft has had 44 security advisories in 20 months...:"

    Lol. .. This must be a joke!! If Microsoft made a decent browser (in your dreams) in the first place, they wouldn't have needed all those security advisories and fixes. Guys, IE is an inferior product. IE is just unsecure bloatware anyways.
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    Feuer Frei, I must comment, really. You write,

    If Microsoft made a decent browser (in your dreams) in the first place, they wouldn't have needed all those security advisories and fixes.


    I write, "If Firefox made a decent browser, they wouldn't have 2.3 advisories per month." As for your other claim,

    IE is just unsecure bloatware anyways.


    I write, "Firefox took 11.3% more RAM than Internet Explorer." Did you bother to read the article?
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    Where can I find the source of this 'IE' program so I can compile and install it?
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    It would be nice to point out that these features like the taskbar grouping and the security are in win xp, which is dangerously insecure at best, even with sp2. I use 98se which is more compatible with different apps, and almost impenetrable with a NAT, compared to xp with is constantly being exploited. I have only ever had two viruses on my machine and only one actually did something. As such, most these "features" are not available for me.

    However, I am forced to use IE at my TAFE College, and it cannot compare. the home page takes 20+ seconds to load and it is unusable during that time. the autosearch is set on but never works. popup blocking also never works. Not to mention that I on average have to reset and reload all my pages 9+ times an hour, due to "Internet Explorer has encountered an error and must close" I have spoken to the teachers, tech support, and administration, and they have said they would use anything but IE. I can't blame them.

    I'd just stick to using 98 with firefox. It has everthing I need, is more secure, and does load much faster than IE, and I am on a p3-450
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    Wow! IE is better and faster than Firefox! Could you give me instructions on how to install it on my Linux box. ;) :p
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    IE is SO full of CRITICAL unpatched security holes:
    http://secunia.com/product/11/#advisories

    In my experience, IE is the main vector by which adware/spyware gets on to people's computers. Using FireFox is the single most effective thing people can do to avoid adware/spyware.
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    IE offers extensions. Ok, to reword that: Numerous developers are offering extensions for IE. There might be a difference, but it's not vast, basically with FF you can access the extensions within the browser while on IE you have to search for them. But IE extensions are better. Ever heard of Avant Browser, NetCaptor or Maxthon(MyIE)? Each of these adds about as many features as 100 Firefox (as well as the tabbed browsing everyone wants from IE!) extensions in just one simple installation. No longer will you have to look painfully for the right extension for you which is also compatible with your version of Firefox. And guess what? None of these IE extensions are as slow as Firefox, according to my benchmarks which can be found here: http://www.web-realm.com/?page=articles_-_firefox . Might be a little inaccurate and outdated but they still display the basic ratios.

    As for tabbed browsing, yes, it's better than Task Grouping (annoying crap), but read the above paragraph to find out how to get tabbed browsing for IE.

    About viruses and spyware, I don't know what you guys are talking about, because I never had any spyware because of IE (and definitely not viruses). But assuming your claims are correct, who cares? Every internet user knows about spyware and those who don't learn about it after their first encounter (when they ask a friend who knows how to remove it). Therefore, internet users do regular spyware scans, regardless of browser. Nowadays half the programs you can download contain spyware (ok, an exaggeration, but chances are, you've downloaded one before).

    As for using it on Linux, I guess Linux users can stick to Firefox. It's actually good because it will encourage devs to code for both browsers since they'll know that about 10% could be using Firefox. As for Windows users... don't really see a reason to 'dump IE'.
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    MyIE2, NetCaptor, etc are all just layover programs (essentially acting like skins do on WinAMP). They all use the IE core and thus, are vunerable to every single security flaw that IE is. Tabbed browsing is a good enough reason to dump IE for Firefox. I use both browsers. Each has its uses.
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    You are so wrong its not even funny. First, you said IE works well with standards. Thats bs, ask people over at the w3c. Tabbed browsing is very diferent than grouping in taskbar. Also, your results are obviosly wrong, compare what loaded in ie as to firefox, total up explorer.exe and iexplore.exe and the dll loading mshtml thing. Then youll get better results.

    Also, what about people with earlyier version of windows? They can't even get SP2. So then whats the point of spreading it.
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    Hi, just a comment on security.
    Firefox doesn't even think about download ActiveX binaries, which IE does with standard settings. Yes you get a dialog box, but *ordinary people* have a tick cklicking OK and not Cancel. Besides, they don't even understand the question even though it is phrased in their mother tounge. They just want to get to the new page as quick as possible, and clicking OK gets them there, together with virus, spam bots, spyware, modem kidnappers, advertising, you name it. Firefox is immune and keeps your computer immune, too.